See to me the primary instrument, the instrument that was really like an oracle for me in the music was the piano, were the great pianists. They had the polyphony that they could do, they could put combinations of tones together. And to me the real intrigue was sort of in the harmonic dimension. So the saxophone was sort of midway between the piano and me. And I looked to the saxophones sort of as the messengers of the piano genius. It was a way of, they were in the stream of translation from what could happen with the, what these guys were cooking up on the keyboards. The saxophonists then made possible a translation that other horn players could pick up on. And I think that's why I was really attracted to the saxophone players. Because then I would take what the saxophone players were doing, and I'd distill it even further to get it down to where I could handle it. And I found ways where I could participate in what they were doing but maybe without ten fingers on a pipe. I would have to find other ways to connect with these harmonic keys -- well that's another redundancy -- but these harmonic ingredients, these harmonic components, harmonic ... -- help me, Monk, Monk, help me -- these harmonic thing.  Phenomenon. Harmonic phenomenon. I could still be in the ballpark with a saxophonist.  Yet the trombone brings in a whole other quality that's more natural to the instrument, which I call singing. And therefore the singing combined with the harmonic innovativeness made, to me, was what brought about the great jazz trombonists of this century. Because they brought all the vocalization, combined that with the harmonic innovation from the system, put that together into melody, rhythm and sound and color, and created a whole unique music. It's in the trombone playing more than in the saxophones and more than in the trumpet, at least I think so. But everybody's picking up on everybody else you know. There's a language circulating all over the place. And you hear something beautiful and you just want to be able to do it yourself and so you go ahead and try. But with the bone, you can't play every note of a Coltrane saxophone solo.  But you find ways maybe to get certain shapes here and there, and certain dynamics. And then you bring the trombone vocalization to that and you have another music.