So well yeah, but I found out you have to listen to find out what they're doing. And it's new so it's strange, so you have to get used to ... give it a good listen and find out what they're doing. I know the first time I heard Bop well I'd been around Dizzy quite a bit, so he was just getting it together, you know with the flat fives and raised ninths. And nobody knew what he was doing. He used to drive little trumpet players crazy. I was working in a place called Monroe's Uptown House and we had two trumpet players: Vic Coolson and Joe Treadwell who later married Sarah Vaughan. They bought themselves a couple of cornets and it was terrible to hear them try to play like Diz, I mean they were in bad shape. But they tried.