I wanted to be a musician, and I kind of fell into the studio thing. I could always jam, I mean Springfield, Massachusetts back in those days, we had a little Bebop band with Sal Salvador, the guitar player with Kenton, Joe Morello, who became Brubeck's drummer, the famous "Take Five" solo is Joe Morello. Chuck Andrews on bass, he was with Woody Herman's band when Nat Pierce was the piano player, and who am I leaving out, oh Hal Serra, a very fine piano player. And Al Bryant on trumpet, who I think maybe he's still out there contracting for Lionel Hampton's band. So we had a little Bebop band at that time, in fact Hal Serra and I used to come to New York to study with Tristano. Al started studying with Tristano and I said I'd like to take some lessons, so prior to moving to New York for that summer course in Manhattan, I was commuting from Springfield to take lessons with Tristano. So I guess I always wanted to be a jazzman. I didn't think I was really worthy. I mean I didn't know whether I had it. Like I mean I had the same doubts as any young person does, you don't know how you are until you get out there and compete. But one thing I learned at Juilliard was that I mean as a jazzman I always said "well I can't be as good as these classical guys. " There's always been that divide between the -- I mean we play classical but... Even though I was a clarinet major, I was still the guy that played the alto sax. Everybody knows who you are in a school situation. And there's the lounge lizards and then there's the Beboppers and all that. But it turned out that, not competing, but being around all these other kids, I found out I was better than I thought I was. I mean I could play the piano. A lot of the violin players couldn't play the piano. I mean I can play a little Bebop Bud Powell, but it served me very well for placement in my keyboard harmony class. I could at least get around and I could read because I worked at it. A lot of the classical people weren't quite that concerned about it, whereas a jazzman, most jazz cats have a very nice understanding of keyboard harmony.  It kind of goes with the turf. So yeah, indirectly I always was aiming towards being a jazzman.