Yeah. I worked with Mulligan for a shorter period of time. I worked at Birdland with him for I think it was a one week engagement. And I did a few concerts. This was when he had the concert jazz band, which was a precursor to the Thad Jones-Mel Lewis band. Thad was in this band, Mel Lewis played drums in the band, and it was from that experience that Mel Lewis and Thad -- well I knew Thad, I'd met Thad some years before -- invited me to be in the Thad Jones and Mel Lewis jazz orchestra. But I mean my work with Lionel Hampton and for the longer periods with Mingus -- because I worked with Mingus two times, in 1964 and again in '65. All of that was a tremendous learning experience, not only learning musically but learning how people maneuver the audience in their band. And I was very interested in seeing how people were able to be the masters of their audience -- Lionel Hampton was a lot different than Charles Mingus.