He's taught himself. He composes Ragtime that is so difficult to play it's amazing. He really is, it really is a genius grant in his case. And I think he must be maybe -- at the time that he really emerged he was only 18 I believe, and that was maybe ten years ago.  So he's possibly he's 30 now and he got the grant maybe four years ago I think. But he's one of the few in Ragtime. There are a couple of other black musicians in Ragtime. In the traditional jazz world there are very few and I think that that's because in the black community the musicians tend to go for the cutting edge. They're always looking for something different rather than going back and playing the music that's been played before. I think they tend to be innovators. And so I think that they're always looking ahead rather than looking back. I feel badly that they don't appreciate the tremendous history and in some cases they thought of it as Uncle Tom music because it was black bands playing for white audiences but having to come in the back door. So they didn't want anything to do with it. I do think that it's very healthy that Wynton Marsalis has said hey this is worth pursuing and worth learning about. I think he's been very good for the music in that sense and helping the black community realize that there's value in that history. So I really give him credit for that.