So the guy that was roadie - he wasn't roadie. He was just working for Lester Young that night, hanging with Lester Young, trying to get the gig to go to <span class="otherMatch" rel="popover" id="other_2631_1155118">California</span>, which he knew about. He put me in a taxi, took my drums. I caught a cold that night, because I was out there waiting in the snow. I'm living 149th Street, that same house I told you about. He brought me to the house. We brought the drums upstairs. Next day, he said, "Let me get you something to eat," because I was in bed with a ... cold. We're supposed to play Elizabeth, New Jersey. That's when they had the big snow storm in New York. You may have heard about it. It was one of the biggest snow storms in years. Okay, he comes and gets the drums. He says, "Let me bring the drums down. " He brought the drums downtown. Lester Young's living at the Hotel Marden - M-a-r-d-e-n. Underneath there's a bus terminal. He checks the drums in the bus terminal. Don't ask me why he did all this. I found later - to make a long story short, when we get ready to leave to go to Cincinnati, Ohio, the day there's no drums. They did have some drums down there, but they weren't mine. They had maybe a bass drum - if I was a different type of guy, I would have taken them. To make a long story short, this guy disappears with the drums. We had to leave and go on a train to Cincinnati, Ohio, with no drums. Ezra Charles was heavyweight champion then. The road manager, Charlie Carpenter, called the union and got a buddy of Ezra Charles, who ended up being my buddy for life after that - there was a drummer. We used his drums. I forget his name offhand. Anyhow, he brought his drums to the gig. We leave there and go to Chicago. When we get to Chicago, Charlie Parker had just messed up in the job where we were going to open. Miles and Max Roach is with him. Charlie Parker carries on there. I don't know. A whole long - anyhow, Charlie Parker gets fired. In the meantime, I think Howard McGhee goes in there. So meantime, Max Roach and Miles were still in town, half stranded. I think they got back through the union or something. In the meantime, they're all at this club where we're going to open the following week. Howard McGhee is there now, but Miles and Max Roach are still hanging there, because Bird had either blew the gig or something. So I told Max Roach about the drums being stolen. He said there's a guy from Ludwig here, a young guy. That's how I hooked on with - we went there. It was a Friday night. Saturday morning - we were staying on the south side of Chicago - we took the subway all the way down to the north side of Chicago, where the factory was. Then we had to   take a trolley car. It seemed like going to Milwaukee. It felt like Milwaukee. All Polish people. We went to the factory. Joe Harris went with me. We stayed up all that night and straight to - they - I got some drums for about $100. I had owed them some money. Each week I would send them money. I'm still with Lester Young. It's the same thing. I'm playing Seattle, all those gigs, went to California. I'm sending them money. So the next year I want a set of drums. They even give me some ... cymbals. They weren't Zildjian. Something that I could make my gig. It sounded like ... But I was swinging, so it didn't matter. That's the first 20-inch bass drum. This is when this ... - 20-inch wasn't even heard of. 20-inch bass drum. Gold - white - not gold. What did? - pearl, white pearl. So the next year I got a set. I started getting pretty popular. I'm making records, and the jazz polls, I'm in there. So they say, "Okay, you're not going to have to pay for these drums. We'll give it to you. " From then on, which may have been '49, '50, whatever, I was getting drums from <span class="partialMatch" rel="popover" id="partial_2706_666">William F. Ludwig. Ludwig. Ludwig</span>, ever since. They were called WFL then, William F. Ludwig. They used the initial WFL. Then - that's a long time ago, ain't it? That's the hookup with <span class="partialMatch" rel="popover" id="partial_2688_401">William F. Ludwig. Ludwig. Ludwig</span>. That was still indirectly through Max Roach. Max Roach was using them too. Then - I would get a feature in a magazine. They say, when you get a feature in a magazine, always let us know, so we'll run our drum ad. One year I was getting a feature. This is back maybe in the '50s or going - maybe getting ready to go in the '60s. I call them up, tell them I was - the magazine was doing something on me. I think it was Down Beat. So they acted like they had attitude. They said, "Boo hoo hoo. So what? " They didn't say that. So that quick, I called up Slingerland and made an appointment to go by. That was their competitor. Went to Slingerland, asked them for a drum stick, asked them for all of that ... They put - made an agreement with them and then sent <span class="partialMatch" rel="popover" id="partial_2704_403">William F. Ludwig. Ludwig. Ludwig</span> a telegram to tell them I discontinue the use of his drums. He said he had a heart attack when he got the letter. He told me this later. I stayed with Slingerland five years. They treat me good. Then I rejoin Stan Getz. This is a good way to get him back in. That's when Gary Burton's there. <span class="fullMatch" id="match_555">Gary Burton</span> is using <span class="otherMatch" rel="popover" id="other_2732_1199516">Musser</span> vibes and they give me a new set of <span class="partialMatch" rel="popover" id="partial_2712_669">William F. Ludwig. Ludwig. Ludwig</span> drums. We take a picture, a group picture. There's Stan Getz again with his big opportunity. Did I tell you that? He got his whole group, or a whole full page, in color, and he got a set of drums, I think. So there's some importance in it. Now I'm playing. All these guys - I'm older than Stan Getz, a couple years maybe, and all these other guys are kids. So the younger audience is coming in. Stan Getz wasn't doing too good then right away, but later on, that's when he had that bossa nova thing. There were periods when we'd play Hollywood at the Renaissance. We'd follow Miles. Business was bad as hell. We had two weeks. They had to cut it to weekends. That's another time I played with John Coltrane one part of the week - the first part of the week. I played with Stan Getz on the weekend. Stan Getz didn't like that. It wasn't hurting him. Jesus Christ. You've got me re-living this ... again. I could write a book. It would be a bestseller. I was heading for something. I forget what it was.